Course Design Feedback & Discussion - FSAE Lincoln

[raitinger]

The course maps for FSAE Lincoln 2014 are complete. For some reason the layers don't seem to be working correctly on all files, but I'll try to get that resolved. Also, disregard the corner speed and accel assumptions, this was just a basic tool for us to estimate the speeds in specific areas.

We were able to incorporate many of the elements that people were interested in. So, I think everyone will really enjoy this year's courses. These are subject to change once we get everything set up on site. We'll be looking at safety, cone visuals, fun factor etc etc. Comments are certainly welcome, but the major aspects of the layout are finalized. For the teams that do pull data from these maps, how easy or difficult is this format? If needed, we can look at other means of delivering the info.


PDFs and Full Site Map

[Alumni]

Any concern with the driver change exit being in the middle of a straight? Particularly given the distance it is from a passing zone, I could see a lot of cars being nearly run over as they slow down to exit as the car behind them is still accelerating.

Stalling re-entering the track could also be an issue.

Otherwise looks like a blast. I wish I had had the chance to drive this in endurance.

[mech5496]

Wow! Just wow! Seems like the most intriguing track layout I have seen in FSAE competitions so far, and indeed it includes most of the suggested ideas!

[raitinger]

Any concern with the driver change exit being in the middle of a straight? Particularly given the distance it is from a passing zone, I could see a lot of cars being nearly run over as they slow down to exit as the car behind them is still accelerating.

Stalling re-entering the track could also be an issue.

Otherwise looks like a blast. I wish I had had the chance to drive this in endurance.

Not really any concerns with the start. For scale each grid square is 25'x25', and the cars are actually launched a little more than 25' to the right of the driving line. Of course the starter only sends cars when there is an open spot on track with no one coming for decent ways.

For the exit I do see the concern you are talking about, and we had one instance last year where this was an issue. Someone was just a little too aggressive with trying to get around the car exiting the track.

[MCoach]

At first I was thinking that it looked reminiscent of Sebring....but something just didn't sit right. It Sebring is flat, but bumpy like Lincoln, but I felt like it didn't convey it properly. Then I realized I knew I had seen this layout before!

Behold!

http://images.motorcycle-usa.com/Pho...-track-map.jpg

[Edward M. Kasprzak]

At first I was thinking that it looked reminiscent of Sebring....but something just didn't sit right. It Sebring is flat, but bumpy like Lincoln, but I felt like it didn't convey it properly. Then I realized I knew I had seen this layout before!

Behold!

http://images.motorcycle-usa.com/Pho...-track-map.jpg

I'm thinking Road America (with many more wiggles, of course)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Road_America.svg

There's only so many ways to fold a track onto a rectangle of available land! Maybe they can try for Suzuka in 2015? That would be, um, "interesting".

[Z]

Raitinger,

Still no hairpin bends???

(As specified in the Rules, these would require a car to do a 180 deg turn in about the width of one of your paving blocks, namely less than 9 metre outer-wheel-path diameter.)

I know all the teams complain when a proper hairpin is put in the course ("Awww, it's just toooo haaaaard..."), but as I pointed out earlier my 30 ton loader used to manage them just fine. Also some of the better designed, full-size production cars of olden days.

Good places to put such a hairpin would be at the bottom left or right of either of your tracks.

If you don't want to do such "Rules spec" hairpins, then maybe you can put the tighter corners in a place where wider entry and exit lines take the car's outer-wheels over some big cracks/steps in the pavement. Cars that can corner sharper thus avoid these steps.

Or maybe do a genuine "hairpin" section of track. Here the outsides of the two lanes are 9 metres apart, with a row of cones down the centreline. Past the last centreline cone the "outside" of the track widens out to maybe 20 metres. This way a "well designed" car simply takes the U-turn in the 9 metre wide section, while the "poorly designed" cars have to drive a bit further to get to the wider section, where they can then take the U-turn without knocking over cones.

Again, the goal of this is to get better educated engineers who can design production cars with good (= tight) turning circles.

Z

[Canuck Racing]

Z- If you want some hairpins go stand out at the far end of FSG or MIS.

Also, with your 180 degree turn idea, how do you deal with two cars driving head on at each other during endurance separated only by a thin line of cones? Even if you replaced them with low height water barriers - assuming those exist - you'd still have a very messy scene if a car lost it under brakes or acceleration.

[Claude Rouelle]

Canuck Racing,

I have seen at least one 180 degree sharp short radius hairpin (in Italy) and I did not see any problem except that several drivers did not have the car or the driving skills or both to negotiate it. I think one 180 degrees minimum legal radius should be part of the competition. Or better 2 or 3 in a row: Left - Right or Left - Right - Left. The speed is minimum; risk of crash is minimum too. It is possible to make is difficult and safe. It looks like a parking lot exercise; yes so what; this is not racing. it is FSAE / FS! There will also be other faster corners, larger radius on the track.

[Claude Rouelle]

In a general; way, I still find this kind of track too easy on drivers (sils and fatigue) and on cars. Too many low speed and high speed slaloms. I do like the tightening radius of the Autocross, I wish there was at least one in the Endurance. And of course a few tight hairpins, ideally one after the other. But to be honest I never designed such tracks so I am not the best one to offer good alternatives. In any case it will be fun.