New Engine for Indian Teams

[vandit]

even i had the doubt on power output....because every engine in sub continent is compromised on power to give more mileage....but pat mentioned something about increasing power ...lets see what he has to say on increasing power....

[shampoo]

yeah.. increasing power is possible. Pat told us that that RPM limit is only artificial because they want more life for the engine and we can adjust the ECU settings. Also compression ratio may be adjusted a bit but the problem is the weight. In fact our prof was saying instead use the pulsar 220!

[vandit]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by shampoo:
In fact our prof was saying instead use the pulsar 220! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


oooh!....pulsar 220!...that engine gives like what some 20 odd bhp....i really dont have idea how much can you power can you churn out from that engine....and probably your whole drive train will have to go under serious make over ....

[stealth]

hello everyone...
can i know from where we can get the master switches in INDIA which suit the specification of FSAE ?(i saw some pics in rules book)

[Steve Fox]

Fart Can, & all other non-Indian FS team members,

(Now, Fart Can, I don't really mean to single you out here, but let's face it mate, you opened your mouth, and then stuck your foot in it, clear up to your ankle bone! This forum is for constructive comments! )

What you have to realize is that the Indian teams are hugely resource challenged. In order to get a F4i engine, they either have to get it on the black market, for a large sum of cash (in excess of $12,000USD if I am remebering correctly, for a VERY used piece ), or they pay even more for a 'legit' used engine.

The advantage to the black market engine, is its 'low' price, the problem with the black market engine is getting it back into the country after competition.

The next time you are at a FS competition, why don't you try and make a point of going over and introducing yourself to any of the Indian teams. They are all very friendly, and have great Can-Do attitudes. Their biggest problem is resources! They have very few parts to work with, very few tools and limited facilities.

I would be willing to bet that most American teams, if faced with the same problems the Indian teams face daily, would give up way before getting the car anywhere near completed. The luxury advantages we have are sometimes taken for granted. Take a little time to poke your head up out of your own hole and look at what others around you have to deal with. It can be a very hunbling experience.

I for one am very pleased to see the number of Indian teams participating in FS type events. They are a very resourseful bunch, & they keep getting better all the time.

[JD232]

I dont think Enfield is a suitable option...
the power output is nowhere near the honda or yamaha engines.. yes it can give you a car that completes the race and easy availability but you cant win a race with it. I dare any team to do it... and Indian team might not have won yet but that dont mean we dont aim for a win.

Thanks for the support Mr. Fox but seriously, $12,000?? where did you get that figure?
I can get you at least 4 if not 5 engines for that... and all honda/yamahas...

[ben]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Steve Fox:

What you have to realize is that the Indian teams are hugely resource challenged. In order to get a F4i engine, they either have to get it on the black market, for a large sum of cash (in excess of $12,000USD if I am remebering correctly, for a VERY used piece ), or they pay even more for a 'legit' used engine.

The advantage to the black market engine, is its 'low' price, the problem with the black market engine is getting it back into the country after competition.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is the context I'm convinced Claude Rouelle was using when he is alleged to have said "even the indians do better" when criticising a UK team.

Outside the top positions, which pretty much judge themselves most of the time, you have to judge cars relative to the resources the team has available in their native country and offer encouragement from that position.

Everyone takes the competition very seriously when their directly involved in a car and can see this as "favouritism" but having the opportunity to judge a variety of teams over the past few years I've truly appreciated the educational aspect of the competition, and it is education rather than real racing despite what it feels like at the time.

Ben

[PSUAlum06]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Silverback:
I dont think Enfield is a suitable option...
the power output is nowhere near the honda or yamaha engines.. yes it can give you a car that completes the race and easy availability but you cant win a race with it. I dare any team to do it... and Indian team might not have won yet but that dont mean we dont aim for a win.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

While I fully understand the concerns about power output there's a lot to be said for a motor that's easy to source, reliable, and well supported locally. Will a perfectly tuned Enfield beat a moderate 600cc sportbike motor? probably not, but it'll absolutely destroy an F4i with a mangled crankshaft, bent valves, or that's otherwise in dubious condition.

You'd also be surprised at how little power you need in order to be competitive if you have a car with well-sorted handling.

[TorqueWrench]

I agree with what PSUAlum06 said. You don't need tons of power to be competitive.

UB went to Detroit with a Briggs V-Twin that is putting out (by our best guess, our dyno is broken and we still don't have a pull) about 30HP. I won't even try to guess at torque. We ended up placing 14th in the Endurance/Fuel Economy and 18th Overall.

Now I'm not saying that the car couldn't have used more straight line power (that was one of the drivers' complaints), but it just goes to show that you don't need to be putting out 75+HP to do well in the competition. Simply finishing the endurance race in the time requirement will help you place pretty high in the competition, so a bullet-proof engine that is slightly underpowered is certainly not a bad idea.

[JD232]

You missed the point... I am sure UB Racing voluntarily didnt go in with a 30HP engine... Its commendable finishing 14th under the circumstances but still..

I cant contemplate the idea of starting a project with a presumption that you cant win... thats simply not how you do things.

For Indian Teams... the 400cc(Honda, cant remember the model) class popular in Hongkong makes a better choice, with a power output of 50BHP.. it will be hell lot lighter... and we were getting it for less than US$1500.. so its a bargain.. even an enfield costs more than that.. if you give even a little time you can find that engine in any of the bigger cities in India.. contact me if you want it in India.. I can probably hook you up with the guy who deals in it....