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Thread: 2015 FSAE-Australasia

  1. #71
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    I will try and make this structured as possible given the posts and points made. Just expanding from what Wordley has said/student perspective.

    Team Development
    Upper management know where the team will be in 3 years time and hopefully this foresight will continue as the years roll on. A lot of it comes down to our vision: to be the most respected FSAE team in the world.
    Most of our final year projects/designs don't end up being on the current car but are developmental projects that future teams can use/implement - much like ECU's custom engine.
    For example, my FYP was based around aero design tools and processes rather than the design of the actual 2015 aero package. Therefore future aero designers can use better CFD models, new wind tunnel rig, pressure tapped wings etc.
    We try and enforce a culture that cares about the future team as much as the current team, whilst respecting what has been achieved and what has failed in the past. We are lucky compared to some universities that the university allows students to join FSAE early on and stay for 3-4 years.
    Hydro - the interconnected suspension system - is one of these developments. Drew, our M13 chief, drove UWA 2011 car at FSAE-west hosted by ECU in 2012. Given the feedback and experience from that, he completed the research on the system and made a system that was interchangeable with our direct acting on M14 so the 2015 team could test with it. We then had another member, Alan, who followed on with this to develop the system you will see on M15.
    We use Google Sites to document all stages of design and how the part performs (along with finances/sponsorship/management etc) to ensures that future members can research previous designs and failures.
    A lot of systems on the car need more work (especially the 'low hanging fruit') but from what I have seen from our new members they will ensure that this happens and to a high level.

    Team History/Function
    In the past, we have put most of finances into travelling to Europe and composite parts such as wings (better dollar per point than monocoque). Our cars are heavy. But 10 years ago when the team tried a monocoque the car didn't even drive at comp (classic delamination). The team had never finished an endurance before that and was another point for which the uni to threaten to pull funding if we couldn't complete the competition/prove it was worth the uni's money. From there, the team focused on building a reliable car and allowing plenty of time for testing - which reduces your design and manufacture period. This produced completed endurances, enabled the team to iterate on a reliable design whilst improving team culture/management. This snowballed after 2010 where the team travelled to the UK and were third quickest in autox (despite being 'heavy' and with wings that make too much drag :P http://www.racecar-engineering.com/b...gs-and-things/) and then produced M11, the single-cylinder big-wing car that was driving by August and tested through till comp in December (also travelled to Europe, that car did nearly 2000km of driving...).
    Since then, the team has worked on the ability to compete at Aus Comp during the first year of the FSAE rules (M15), travel with a updated car to Europe the next year (M15-R) and then drive with a further developed car at Aus-Comp (M16). Given our resources/time/money, this is the best method for our team.

    Carbon Wheels/Monocoque
    This has been down to the carbon we were fortunate enough to be sponsored. The pre-preg carbon we have has to be cured at 180 degrees, hence we are having a lot of issues with moulds. Also the development time for carbon wheels was quicker than the 'coque and our auto claves can fit wheel sized moulds but not coque moulds. We have designed this year's car with the intent to transfer parts onto a 'coque before Europe next year (not enough testing was going to be completed before design period ended). Sophia showed that whilst the first coque is heavy, further understanding leads to lighter designs (they have a picture on FB of their weight progression).
    Ensuring the data and testing is proven is essential to a reliable car, hence we are still looking at different coque methods (folded, 3/4 etc)

    Unsprung Aero
    Probably worth another thread, but the biggest benefit is consistent aero balance. Our undertray is connected to the chassis so not all aero loads are unsprung.
    Aero is one of the key things that we focus on with knowledge transfer and team development - there is so much that hasn't been explored that even if the current rule set stayed the same for the next 5 years we would still find things to improve on...

    Hydro
    As above, developed and tested on a previous car and then new system designed for M15. Again, another thread is worth for mode-separated suspension given UQ/UWA/our designs.
    Werribee, the old comp site, had a crested road and would have been excellent for mode-separated suspension, FSG/Calder Park are quite bumpy which

    Shifter
    Whilst pneumatic systems are known to be annoyingly unreliable, we know the system back-to-front and know how to maintain it to ensure that it doesn't fail. Our mechanical 'safety' system, back when we also used the air for DRS and shifting, weighed 500g. For something that hadn't been done by the team before and therefore unknown reliability, it was a easy decision to put on the car. Removing the system once we figured it out enabled other parts (engine/exhaust) to be repositioned (lower mass/cg). This is a good example of knowledge transfer/continual improvement/reliability.

    3D Printed Ti
    Ensuring good industry engagement is a great way for the team to improve its reputation and knowledge base. CSIRO and Monash Uni have a lot of shared research (also based across the road from us) and discussions about electron beam 3D Ti printing came through connections. Whilst there is ways to get lighter/stiffer/simpler designs, this method has been an amazing experience for team members who go into industry having experience that some people in industry haven't heard of. FSAE shouldn't be limited to automotive engineers/motorsport and additive manufacturing is an industry the Victorian/Aus government is supporting (given the decline of the aussie automotive industry), so having engineers graduating having experienced the technology is a win-win for both parties. We also saved some weight in the process

    Summary
    Kev and Z were pretty much correct in their observations. A number of things to work on but we are always developing, always planning for the future. No car will be perfect, depends too highly on balance between current team and future teams.
    FSAE applies differently to each team (size/cost/time/resources). I believe the FSAE experience we have for us is the best - for our team. It wouldn't work for every team. Having an academic advisor around to remind everyone on the past and the future enables our method to operate successfully.
    Ensuring team members can complete uni at a high level, work part-time jobs, go on exchange, etc means that the work is shared around and parts won't always be the lightest/stiffest parts in FSAE. But the drive so that one day in the future the team achieve this is there.

    PS
    We are excited (and worried) about the speed of other teams. ECU came close last year - with a cheaper/lighter/more powerful car - and had it not been for our very-experienced drivers (Drew and Chris) it could have been a different story...
    UQ is going to be a powerhouse. Having two cars under one roof (and actually getting them both running at the same time), experience with aero-beam, great management (from what we see on the outside), testing early, ECU-esc concept (folded-coque beam-axle 600cc).
    The level at which Canterbury is evolving is nothing short of outstanding. After joining in 2013, they have turned up this year with a monocoque/wings/turbo single/pneumatic shifter that has been driving for the past 4 months.

    UTS, Newcastle (NU), Melbourne (MUR), RMIT-e, Sydney, UNSW Redback have all launched their cars.
    UWA are still quiet, they posted this last year http://www.motorsport.uwa.edu.au:809...s+October+2014

    M15 has completed a comp-spec endurance (though at colder temperatures then expected at comp) and is pretty awesome (compared to M14) through slaloms and high speed lane changes. But there is quite a few reliability issues that we are still working day and night to fix before comp.

    For those who want to follow aus comp:
    SAE-A are a part of 'Team App', download it/sign up/search for Formula SAE/request to join. Should have live updates and timing as well as a number of other features.
    This link has all the team's FB pages https://www.facebook.com/lists/10201073788064567 - I will do the same at some point with Twitter but that isn't as big/used down here.
    InPitLane will be live streaming it again.
    If Z does his summary of teams like previous years they are always a great read.
    Ryan Ockerby
    Monash Motorsport 2012-2015

  2. #72
    Senior Member
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    Perth, Western Australia
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    Ryan,

    Great Post! Thanks for sharing.

    Kev

  3. #73
    Ryan, thanks for the insight. Speaking of, the last update I had from UWA (through their FB page) is that they were cutting foam wing profiles at beginning of September. It is a pity that they are not in their former glory, I believe that their "diamond" car concept had some great potential.

  4. #74
    Senior Member
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    Jun 2007
    Location
    Perth Western Australia
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    UWA is going to the comp, but is in struggle town.

    It would be great if anyone at the comp that is finding success within a Uni that is not really interested could stop by and have a chat.

    Pete

  5. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Marsh View Post
    UWA is going to the comp, but is in struggle town.

    It would be great if anyone at the comp that is finding success within a Uni that is not really interested could stop by and have a chat.

    Pete
    Hi Pete,

    Just curious as to what the UWA definition of "not really interested" is?

    5 or 6 guys from Griffith built a car this year with essentially nothing from their uni but a shipping container. I think the uni may have paid comp entry fee. Their engine was $200 off gumtree and their bodywork is core flute attached to the spaceframe with clips that are used to clip brooms to walls. Every machined component was done by a team member in his spare time at work. Most of the guys on the team work full time. They have received components and material from us (UQ), QUT and Monash (maybe other unis too).

    Anything can be done, you just have to align build expectations with available support.

    Mitchell
    UQ Racing

  6. #76
    Senior Member
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    Perth Western Australia
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    Hi Mitchell,
    There are sufficient material resources to produce a reasonably good car, and 5 or 6 good guys that could do that if that is what they spent their time on. IMO it is not a build expectation issue.

    This thread is not the place for this discussion, but I'd like to say your team's performance is very impressive. I'm sure a couple of our senior guys would be keen for a chat if you have the time.

    Pete

  7. #77

    Just a hint for some of you doing the design videos next year...

    ...as I sit with a fellow judge reviewing your Design videos, it would help if those of you recording these on your phones took care to rotate the video prior to uploading, or at least giving it a run-through to check that it appears as you'd like it to.

    AKA Mitchell, you're an imposing man on a 60" plasma through 90 degrees, and you're giving a few of us a sore neck!

    Good luck this weekend all.

  8. #78
    Tech inspection has started! Woo!

    Link to FSAE-A Facebook and In Pit Lane Livestreams.
    Jay Swift
    Combustion Powertrain
    Global Formula Racing 2013-2014

  9. #79
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    269
    I just read on the Monash FB page that they went into design judging before weigh-in? Isn't this frowned upon? Vehicle weight is critical for the judges. Was this just a typo?
    Formula SAE: When you just can't get rid of a girlfriend.

  10. #80
    Senior Member
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    Mar 2005
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    Australia
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    FRIDAY NIGHT UPDATE - DAY 1 - SCRUTINEERING & STATICS.
    ================================================== ==

    Well, once again the first blow-flies, brown-snakes, and bush-fires of the antipodean summer have convincing your faithful correspondent to head South. Ten hours in the saddle, no air-con, and 35+ degrees outside the car, just shy of the ton in the old money. But probably ten degrees hotter in the glasshouse, and higher humidity than a Turkish sauna. Ah..., summertime!

    But at last your scribe stands in the Melbournian Mecca of International Motorsport - [... drum roll ...] - the "Calder Park THUNDERDOME"! And just like last year the parking area is again in full bloom with every species of weed known to mankind. The now quite cold winds (~20 C and drizzly today) are again blowing the empty crisp packets and old newspapers around the dusty forecourts. There is some new graffiti here and there, conveniently covering the decaying concrete of the grandstands. And, as always, there is that delicious aroma of re-fried cholesterol wafting over from that building with the fading sign that may have once, long ago, read "Food". Oh yes, this is a real racetrack!

    And once again there will be maybe two million dollars worth of machinery assembled here (not including labour costs!). And maybe five hundred eager students, all aching with anticipation. Ah, the vibe!

    Many questions to be answered over the next three days:

    * Who will sail through Scrutineering, and who will still be here on Sunday trying to fit a quart into a pint-jar (ie. get that damned footbox-template to sqeeze into their very slightly undersize tub (you know who you are...))?
    (Stop press: All the usual problems so far, including many Teams looking for muffler-pack.)

    * How many wheels will come adrift during brake-test?
    (Stop press: Have not seen any yet, but it was on the other side of a hill.)

    * How will the "Coal-Fired, Steam-Engined, Poison-in-a-Bottle" Teams react to this old caveman's suggestions that they are stuck 150 years in the past, rather than "advancing into the future" as per their delusions?
    (Stop press: The Swinians were swarming like a well-poked wasp-nest last year, so, along with that re-fried cholestrol, there is also the distinct smell of a lynching in the air!)

    * How many Teams will "Fail to Proceed", despite only having to build a car that can drive ~30 kms at an average speed of ~50 kph?

    * The BIG QUESTION: Will the Monash juggernaut continue to crush all before it? Will six victories in a row become seven?

    * Who will come out on top of the very competitive dog-fight that is forming just below Monash?

    * Who will be crying into their beers on Sunday night, muttering "We could've..., should've..., would've..."?

    * Who will be driving home Monday with the perfect plan for how to "Do It Right!" next year ... perhaps only to have this plan evaporate in the coming Christmas/New-Year festivities, with the Team, once again, going back to "Doing What We Have Always Done"?

    Ah, but that conundrum is too far off in the future to worry about now...

    So, for now, here is your form-guide to the Teams, as judged by your faithful scribbler's shortest of chats with the least busy students.

    (Note - The split-up of Teams in the following posts is mostly about keeping each category/post about the same length (5k char limit per post). So some Teams on the border-line of different categories could have gone either way. Complaints, objections, etc., happily answered by Planet-Zed Publications.)

    Z

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