Plans for new team.

[RollingCamel]

I was thinking about the plan for our next team and would like to have your input about it.

Looking back at our progress last year we had the following difficulties:

1. Faculty Adviser.
No one can work in such project if you can't enjoy it. However, if we changed the adviser we might not be able to use the parts we already have.

2. Place.
Our university lab didn't even have electricity so we couldn't work there; instead we rented a dirty place which was quite small, with just one source of a lousy electric cable and quite bad from safety view point.

3. Tools.
As I thought the welds were bad, even the judges said that it was done by someone welding for the 1st time. We need to manufacture the chassis ourselves. So we really need to focus on getting a TIG welder, tube bender, notcher and other tools so we could produce as much as we could by ourselves. Not a single metal fabricator accepted to do our chassis and they would not tolerate if anyone does a mistake or something. Plus, a dyno would be great.

4. Sponsorship.
We need to get sponsorship early on and fortunately now we could estimate cost more accurately since we now know the process.

5. Management and members.
We had our share of management problems and mistake, and poor members choice. At our level some work was quite spread thin and caused poor results. From the 16 members only 4 were productive, 2 were designing and 2 were good at handwork. The other 12 were just simply leeches.

6. Engine team.
Aside that only one guy was working on the engine with a volunteer, we had a main problem that will face us and the next team(s) if not dealt with it right. Students have no experience working on engines and don't know what should be done for racing. They fear to work on it because they are afraid to break it. FSAE engines do cost considerably because we import it.


Now some thoughts on what the next team should do:

1. I think that they should take their time and start with another project (the engine team members). What I'm thinking of is tuning Fiat twin cam engines since they are dead cheap, has potential and is highly available. They would change it from carb to fuel injection, use dry sump, design intake and exhaust, and play with the header, cams and pistons and etc.
They could depend on Guy Croft's superb book and his advice on his forum. If we want to compete then we need to develop a good engine team.

2. Decrease the team number and put higher standards for the team members. The thing is that they will be a completely new team, but I'm demanding that I interview each one. According to the tasks required I believe that 10 is about it, however there is a problem with who has the authority. Frankly, I'd like to lead them until they could stand on their own. This will be a completely new team and most of them are sophomores at best.

3. Create support groups. Who doesn’t get the chance to join this year could join the “Support Groups”. Assuming, that we have several projects at the same time as Mini Baja and FSAE we could create and develop specialized groups which could support the teams. For example, there could be a fatigue simulation and testing group, manufacturing group, optimization group and etc. After sometime these teams would cross-learn from each other and change specialty.
I think that it would be a good way to ease off the work on the main team and in the same time developing new candidates for recruiting.

4. Somehow figure out how to change the adviser. Hopefully, he gets transferred to Lebanon or something.

5. Of course, the most important thing is to transfer the knowledge and for that we may ready seminars and courses to teach them what they need.

6. Working place is really a problem and I don’t know what would be the solution. I wish that they would finish the damn lab which is under reconstruction for more than 3 years. I think that we should try to convince the dean to provide us with a special place for the team.

That's all for now. Would like to know what you think.

[RollingCamel]

I was thinking about the plan for our next team and would like to have your input about it.

Looking back at our progress last year we had the following difficulties:

1. Faculty Adviser.
No one can work in such project if you can't enjoy it. However, if we changed the adviser we might not be able to use the parts we already have.

2. Place.
Our university lab didn't even have electricity so we couldn't work there; instead we rented a dirty place which was quite small, with just one source of a lousy electric cable and quite bad from safety view point.

3. Tools.
As I thought the welds were bad, even the judges said that it was done by someone welding for the 1st time. We need to manufacture the chassis ourselves. So we really need to focus on getting a TIG welder, tube bender, notcher and other tools so we could produce as much as we could by ourselves. Not a single metal fabricator accepted to do our chassis and they would not tolerate if anyone does a mistake or something. Plus, a dyno would be great.

4. Sponsorship.
We need to get sponsorship early on and fortunately now we could estimate cost more accurately since we now know the process.

5. Management and members.
We had our share of management problems and mistake, and poor members choice. At our level some work was quite spread thin and caused poor results. From the 16 members only 4 were productive, 2 were designing and 2 were good at handwork. The other 12 were just simply leeches.

6. Engine team.
Aside that only one guy was working on the engine with a volunteer, we had a main problem that will face us and the next team(s) if not dealt with it right. Students have no experience working on engines and don't know what should be done for racing. They fear to work on it because they are afraid to break it. FSAE engines do cost considerably because we import it.


Now some thoughts on what the next team should do:

1. I think that they should take their time and start with another project (the engine team members). What I'm thinking of is tuning Fiat twin cam engines since they are dead cheap, has potential and is highly available. They would change it from carb to fuel injection, use dry sump, design intake and exhaust, and play with the header, cams and pistons and etc.
They could depend on Guy Croft's superb book and his advice on his forum. If we want to compete then we need to develop a good engine team.

2. Decrease the team number and put higher standards for the team members. The thing is that they will be a completely new team, but I'm demanding that I interview each one. According to the tasks required I believe that 10 is about it, however there is a problem with who has the authority. Frankly, I'd like to lead them until they could stand on their own. This will be a completely new team and most of them are sophomores at best.

3. Create support groups. Who doesn’t get the chance to join this year could join the “Support Groups”. Assuming, that we have several projects at the same time as Mini Baja and FSAE we could create and develop specialized groups which could support the teams. For example, there could be a fatigue simulation and testing group, manufacturing group, optimization group and etc. After sometime these teams would cross-learn from each other and change specialty.
I think that it would be a good way to ease off the work on the main team and in the same time developing new candidates for recruiting.

4. Somehow figure out how to change the adviser. Hopefully, he gets transferred to Lebanon or something.

5. Of course, the most important thing is to transfer the knowledge and for that we may ready seminars and courses to teach them what they need.

6. Working place is really a problem and I don’t know what would be the solution. I wish that they would finish the damn lab which is under reconstruction for more than 3 years. I think that we should try to convince the dean to provide us with a special place for the team.

That's all for now. Would like to know what you think.

[BMH]

Wow...many of the things that you are dealing with, we are dealing with as well.

1.) Adviser: We had many many troubles with our primary adviser over the past few years, some worse than others. Very recently, our adviser resigned from his duties to pursue other interests. Which left us open to having our "secondary" adviser as our primary adviser. Before changing advisers, I would make sure that you have someone to replace your current adviser.

2.) Shop/Lab: Wow, I am sorry to hear that you have an insufficient lab to have as a shop. I would discuss with your university more on trying to have access to a better location to have as a shop because of the safety, or lack thereof.

3.) Fabrication: Get a TIG welder and devote several days where key members learn how to TIG Weld.

4.) We are currently going through the sponsorship-seeking process as well. Talk to recent graduates and see where they work. Are they a company you would like to have sponsor the team? Are there any companies that donate money to your university? If so, look into it and see what you can do. Remember, any amount helps.

5.) Management and members:
I think it is nearly impossible to have a team that is full of members that devote 100% of their effort to FSAE. This is due to many reasons. Perhaps some people aren't into the design but rather fabrication, or maybe they would rather deal with business/marketing related stuff. See what sparks their interest and try and keep them. As most people will say, retention and recruitment is one of the biggest challenges in managing a team.

6.) Engine Team: The engines do cost quite a bit, especially for teams overseas. The idea of "practicing" on a small engine is pretty good, however, I would make sure that the engine you select has many parallels to the actual engine you use in a car. There's no sense in learning everything about an orange when you will be using an apple. If you decide to allow team members to work on the engine, make sure they document everything. One thing our team has struggled with is the lack of documentation. Having documentation of the engine could provide detailed instructions of disassembly, reassembly, thoughts on improvement areas, discussions on the physics of certain components/assemblies, etc.

Point (5): Strongly emphasize documentation on the processes, designs, etc. This will reduce the amount of time having to train future team members or time being needed to research certain (almost basic) topics.

Point (6): Since your lab has been under construction, see if the dean will allow the team to help in getting the shop fixed up and all. This would almost be cheap labor for them, plus the team members will have a since of pride in the shop and want things set up neatly.

[vandit]

I read your other post in some thread about attitude of your Faculty Advisor. Does your Faculty Advisor has an elder brother who migrated to India sometime in past because he kind of sounds like our College principal. If i remember correctly from FSG 2010, your faculty advisor is short, bald , French beard guy right !.

Your problems are very similar to what i had during my time. Faculty advisor was never a problem because we always kept a faculty advisor for namesake, who didnt know anything about anything and let us had full control over organization and planning. We had bigger problems with whole Mechanical Engg. dpt. and like i mentioned from College Principal.

The only solution we could find at that time was to keep featuring him and Head of Department regularly in Media articles so that they dont interrupt the progress, meanwhile got things sanctioned from Authority which was higher above both of them. YES, the project taught us politics too.

Regarding team selection. Please dont just reject or select people based on their Tech Interview/knowledge. Like BMH mentioned, there are people who are efficient in some fields but not necessarily Tech. For e.g we had 2 people from Architect dpt. who did splendid job on Sponsorhip front. There were couple of guys who were very smooth in talking with people and tackling the bureaucracy of the College and Bank. I would suggest that you dont close the team selections just with interview, always look out for couple of guys who have organized some kind of College Fest and have experience in getting things done with whole system or may be catch hold of a guy who worked in some manufacturing industry as a trainee and then started his studies. He might be able to find you right person for welding for example. If you expect a person who spends his 90% time sitting in front of a Monitor to Flirt with Bank manager or with Customs Officer than you will always have Headaches.

You had a start this year, you participated , you learnt and now you have a plan - Yes, you are on right track.I wish you Good luck and hope to see you in FSG 2011 with atleast a 'painted' chassis. (if not, then be prepared to get your chassis painted with color of my choice).

Cheers

[RollingCamel]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I read your other post in some thread about attitude of your Faculty Advisor. Does your Faculty Advisor has an elder brother who migrated to India sometime in past because he kind of sounds like our College principal. If i remember correctly from FSG 2010, your faculty advisor is short, bald , French beard guy right !. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think that was Iran's adviser. He was great supporting his team and what really got them is lack of sponsorship. They were smart joining FS-UK class 3, so they joined the static event and had a look at what is done. If they had enough money to get better components, especially the brakes they could have done much better. Good luck for them next year.

Ours was a short fat blob in a grey suit, while other advisers were staying helping their team he would just come to have a picture or talk to any official so he shows out that he is the adviser. And whenever he knows something I don't, he says "I know, you don't". I would love to respond "So fucking what asshole".

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Your problems are very similar to what i had during my time. Faculty advisor was never a problem because we always kept a faculty advisor for namesake, who didnt know anything about anything and let us had full control over organization and planning. We had bigger problems with whole Mechanical Engg. dpt. and like i mentioned from College Principal.

The only solution we could find at that time was to keep featuring him and Head of Department regularly in Media articles so that they dont interrupt the progress, meanwhile got things sanctioned from Authority which was higher above both of them. YES, the project taught us politics too. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

When we found out how the perverts think we did the same thing, but man what a corrupt system we have. The dean also was an asshole and he refused to sign anything for us at the end. Its not our fault that the governor scheduled a meeting when both our adviser and the dean where in Lebanon. Maybe, I'm not the most diplomatic person in the world but God we did try hard to satisfy them. I had one member dedicated for bureaucracy and was a better diplomat than I am, but him too got frustrated at the end.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Regarding team selection. Please dont just reject or select people based on their Tech Interview/knowledge. Like BMH mentioned, there are people who are efficient in some fields but not necessarily Tech. For e.g we had 2 people from Architect dpt. who did splendid job on Sponsorhip front. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm taking the whole process into mind, I don't expect tech knowledge from Sophomores but I'm looking for qualities, eager to learn and work as a team. For example, I'm looking for a good hand-sketcher for PR and body styling, a camera man too and etc. Anyone not willing to work "smart" and would disrupt the team structure will not be tolerated.

I'm really convinced that the team should be run as a company. A successful company is made by successful members.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">You had a start this year, you participated , you learnt and now you have a plan - Yes, you are on right track.I wish you Good luck and hope to see you in FSG 2011 with atleast a 'painted' chassis. (if not, then be prepared to get your chassis painted with color of my choice) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Oh dear, don't make me remember. I was in a terrible state the 1st 2 days. I told the damn adviser that it is not ready or worthy of the competition, but no his image depends on it. Even his wife was a show lover too and i clashed with her at the competition. They could not understand that the car had critical problems so working on the car was a waste of time. I'm very thankful for Hamburg team for helping us, we had some problems so we had to remove the steering column support. The car basically couldn't move and was heavy, not to mention that the weld shop was busy with competing teams busy trying to fix what broke and both of the was on my head telling me to weld the support so the steering wheel looks good. I told them that it would be a waste of time and its not important as other team's problems. They kept saying that we're lazy bla bla bla and the car should look good when it enters the university. I replied "So it is all about looks. Guess what the car already looks crap so it is not going to help. We shouldn't have come in the 1st place. And what you just care about is the looks. So you want looks!"
I ordered my teammate to get up and get epoxy from Henkel to so they could have it looking good.

When we went for the design event, Pat asked: "So you gave up?". I replied: "No, but we have critical problems with the hub and upright, we need new ones. Figuring that out we decided to spread and look at what other teams do and speak to them so we acquire knowledge as much as we could". He said that this was good thinking in front of the adviser but yet he was not convinced. So when the judging started normally the judges are judging the students. The adviser would interfere and even ask questions so he can himself right. In 2003, some students made a Mini-Baja under his supervision and they used Al 6061-T6 for the chassis. Long time ago he told me to use aluminum, but i told him that it wouldn't be a good idea. The hoops must be steel and we are having problems welding steel only, then it was extremely expensive cuz there is a minimum order of quarter ton and the company can't supply us until 2 months later we contacted them. Lastly, the welds were really bad on the baja car, which didn't work too. So in order to prove me wrong he asked the judge if it is possible to use aluminum, knowing what he is after i said yes it was possible but would be a wrong choice for the following reasons.
Man, he is such a child that he tries to compete with students.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">6.) Engine Team: The engines do cost quite a bit, especially for teams overseas. The idea of "practicing" on a small engine is pretty good, however, I would make sure that the engine you select has many parallels to the actual engine you use in a car. There's no sense in learning everything about an orange when you will be using an apple. If you decide to allow team members to work on the engine, make sure they document everything. One thing our team has struggled with is the lack of documentation. Having documentation of the engine could provide detailed instructions of disassembly, reassembly, thoughts on improvement areas, discussions on the physics of certain components/assemblies, etc. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It is not a small engine, the 2000CC is not small and is different. However, the main goal of the idea is to break the students' fear. If he learned from it he will feel confident to work and learn on whatever engine.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Point (5): Strongly emphasize documentation on the processes, designs, etc. This will reduce the amount of time having to train future team members or time being needed to research certain (almost basic) topics. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Done already, although i want to ready presentations.


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Point (6): Since your lab has been under construction, see if the dean will allow the team to help in getting the shop fixed up and all. This would almost be cheap labor for them, plus the team members will have a since of pride in the shop and want things set up neatly. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Talked to him about it before but he just laughed and told us to ask the hydraulic committee to use place in their lab, though he knows that there is no space there. We spoke to him with our advisers at the start and he did nothing.


Btw, I'm really considering that the next team should paint their care with rust...Ze Rust Machine!!

[Ivan Maglica]

I don't understand this part about your faculty advisor

A5.1 Status
Each team is expected to have a Faculty Advisor appointed by the university. The Faculty Advisor is
expected to accompany the team to the competition and will be considered by competition officials to
be the official university representative.
A5.2 Responsibilities
Faculty Advisors may advise their teams on general engineering and engineering project management
theory.
A5.3 Limitations
Faculty Advisors may not design any part of the vehicle nor directly participate in the development of
any documentation or presentation.
Additionally, Faculty Advisors may not fabricate nor assemble any components nor assist in the
preparation, maintenance, testing or operation of the vehicle.
In Brief – Faculty Advisors may not design, build or repair any part of the car.

FSG Rules
2.6 Faculty Advisor
FSG strongly recommends that all participating teams have a Faculty Advisor present with
them at all times, during the competition. In the case of having no Faculty Advisor present
during competition, the Team Captain will take over all responsibilities as the acting Faculty
Advisor.

We have faculty advisor because in rule A5.1 is stated that we need one so we took him in Silverstone and thats it. We would probably took him on FSG with us but he went on vacation so he couldn't come.

In Riteh Racing faculty advisor doesn't have anything with design of a car, team organization or something else.

[RollingCamel]

We too don't want the advisers to do anything, but he doesn't like so. Moreover, he could want to interfere and take decisions against the team's interest.

At the beginning we had a terrific adviser who understands that students should be responsible about what they see fit for their team.

[RollingCamel]

Okay, back on subject.

For the tools there are some options:

Welder:
Mactech Expo is at November and they really have to take advantage of it. All machining tools companies will be present.

The welders I was looking at were Miller Dynasty 250, EWM Tetrix 230 and Powertig 250EX. While the Powertig is cheaper but I don't think that I'll find it in Egypt.

Bender and Notcher:

Looked at JD2 and Baileigh offerings. The JD2 model3 is much cheaper but I'm thinking of going to the Model32 and Notch Master.

[RollingCamel]

Things doesn't seem to look good. The new team didn't form themselves now and the candidates for the new team is not convinced that they can't work with under his supervision. Now he wants control on selection of team members and his criteria is their academic score, he only wants the excellent and very good.
I'm still maneuvering to find another adviser but if not then you may kiss AUM good buy.

I've met 2 of the new Cairo University team and I wish them luck.

[RollingCamel]

Ah well, the doctor wants to put an ad in the university to create a new team of students of with high grades to "honorably" represent the university in FSG 2011.

I'm quite pissed because it is not about grades, although I would respect it if there was a set for the minimum GPA so the student doesn't hurt himself, but he is putting it because he thinks that ppl like me having quite low grades are the problem and is putting a fucking high standard for the wrong reasons. Then "honorable"!! He was the one who insisted to ship the car although my objection because it wasn't competition worthy. Yeah it wasn't something to be proud of but with no vision they will run into the same problem.

I have never seen someone like him before and I'm really sad to see our effort go waste. Sucks that I can't move much since I returned had an anal fistula thanks to the long seat time reading and designing for the project and just as I'm completing recovery some stupid fuck dropped a steel tube on my toe now I have to rest more.

Can't believe how I turned into a such whiner.